IRIN Web Special on Ituri in Eastern DRC

IRIN Interview with Busho Ndinyenka, Ugandan foreign ministry official.

IRIN interviewed Ambassador Busho Ndinyenka, a director of the Ugandan foreign ministry on 10 December. Busho led a Ugandan delegation to the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) capital, Kinshasa, for a meeting on 28-29 September to follow up on the implementation of the Ituri Pacification Committee (IPC), which was created under the Luanda accord of 6 September 2002 between the DRC and Uganda.

QUESTION: Given the continuing insecurity and massacres in Ituri, what do you make of the task ahead of the IPC?

ANSWER: I think it is a challenging undertaking, but one that can be accomplished. It is going to require real muscle, though. It's not enough to meet and agree on what to do. It's going to require taking action with or without the cooperation of the fighting groups. If the Committee cannot get them to agree, it's good enough to have them talking, because one day they will agree. I do not see any problem if they are willing to talk.

Q. Some groups are already opposed to the IPC. How do you deal with such a challenge?

A: We are aware that every action we are going to take, not only through the IPC, will be looked at with suspicion. This is expected in a situation where different groups have different interests. As soon as we signed the Luanda agreement in Angola, one armed militia in Ituri disowned the agreement, saying they were not consulted. This was the UPC [Union des patriotes congolais) led by Thomas Lubanga, because they claim control of Bunia. They think that our effort in Uganda and the government of the DRC has sold them.

Q. So what are the real problems in Ituri?

A: There is in the first place a lot of misinformation on what is happening in Ituri. Every time people write about the situation there, you clearly see that they do not understand the problem. Even the UN panel of experts' report was misinformed and based on rumours. The problem of Ituri is not that there is hatred between the Lendu and Hema plus other tribes. At the grass roots, there is no hostility among the people.

The problem is that there are interested parties who inflame the existing but tolerable differences for political gain. If people cannot find a reason for the killings, then somebody is inflaming them for political gain. The motivation is to attempt to outsmart each other. Different political groups to further their interests only use the other issues that have been raised, such as land, property and lack of authority, as justification.

Q. How, then, do you deal with it?

A: This is a problem of selfish politicians who have created certain perceptions. We shall have to deal with these perceptions. Although our forces are eventually all going to be out of the DRC, we are not oblivious of the situation. We share a common border, so we are conscious of the problems.

Q. What are these perceptions? How are they inculcated into the minds of the people in Ituri?

A: You see, there are players and trends. The different RCD-Kisangani [Rassemblement congolais pour la democratie-Kisangani] leaders are perceived differently at different times depending on the tendencies and trends they take. When Wamba dia Wamba was the president of the RCD-Kisangani, he was seen as an academic. Almost all his leadership were composed of academics. These were people equipped with textbook material.

When they saw the disparity in wealth between the Hema and Lendu, they thought indeed the Lendu were oppressed people, who therefore needed justice, as the rules require. The Hema immediately rejected him, because he was seen as pro-Lendu, having recruited his forces from mainly the Lendu community.

When Mbusa [Nyamwisi] took over, he also took sides, and championed first a Lendu cause. He too was rejected. Today, because Mbusa seems to support the peace process and has been in Kinshasa, there is a perception in Ituri that he gets military support from [DRC President Joseph] Kabila for his APC [Armee populaire congolaise] forces against UPC.

Jean-Pierre Mulondo [Lonpondo], who is the governor of Ituri, appointed by Mbusa, has 12 chiefs under him, and all of them are Lendu. The UPC thinks his administration is a Lendu affair.

Today, although Lubanga is a Hema, he is seen not to be a pure Hema. Being a Gegere [a subclan of the Hema who speak the Lendu language], he is looked at as an interface between the Lendu and Hema. So there is likely to be disagreement between him and Chief Kahwa, another militia leader currently working with UPC in Bunia. Chief Kahwa is a Hema from [the south] and is more respected as a traditional chief.

Continued?